under no gods fighting uncontrolled
click one of the following:
The basics of creature combat. Learn the various moves
of creature fighting.
Basic training methods.
See experimentation results of petting your creature
before and after a creature battle.
Leashes in Combat:
Figure out for yourself what leashes to use or if
to use them at all in battles.
Questions if the creature AI is really as complex
as we all think it is.
Your Creature in Combat:
Talks about different teaching methods such as a controlled
vs. uncontrolled regime.
Talks about how your creature learns how to fight
and a more in-depth description of controlled training.
more in-depth description of controlled training.
An in depth artical about creature minds.
Creature Combat Intro
following is based upon the results of my personal
experiment and research on creature combat in the
game of Black and White™. The following tactics
and methods might not work for eveyone, however I
hope you find the content useful and I wish you a
merry time in your creature training.
aim is to train a creature which will be able to perform
well during un-controlled creature combat. The term
un-controlled means there would be no direction given
by the owner of the creature or any kind of leash
attached to the creature.
combat skills of a creature is simular to “Kung
Fu”. There is a certain pattern or disapline
on how they will attack, when they will stop, and
how and when to react to certain moves by the opponent.
To make your creature able to produce your desired
action and responce, you would need to fill his mind
with experience and preferred method of combat.
teach your creature Kung Fu, we should understand:
what can a creature do during a fight and then how
we want him to do it.
are certain actions available in the combat rings
which I have roughly categorized into the following
Attack 2) Block 3) Dogging 4) Pausing
special note on pausing: When a creature is inexperienced,
you would find that he pauses quite often. It is because
he has no idea on how to respond to the target’s
action or position.
are other actions within the combat ring which is
not controllable by your creature. This is to prevent
the creature from winning too easily in a fight.
Swinging- When your creature has pushed the target
out of the ring a few times, while waiting for the
target’s return, he would swing from left to
right, then right to left repeatedly.
Backing- When your creature has pushed the target
out of the ring a few times, your creature would back
off towards to the middle of the ring.
To train a good creature fighter, we should teach
the creature to have the right response to every action.
First, we will look at how creature can learnt combat
there are a few methods to teach your creature Kung
Fu in the Black and White community, I will analyse
these methods with my personal experiments.
say it is better leave all the fighting uncontrolled
and place your creature to fight different classes
of creature minds. By different classes of creatures
I mean, using a creature mind file which is hand trained
by another player or yourself.
If he did well after a fight, while he is showing
off (either posing or pooping on the other creature),
if you pet him, he will remember how well he did,
and will improve his fighting skill base on that fight.
The scale of reward depends on how much you like the
Black and White player, Dale/Razor suggested to pet
your creature based on how much health he has left
after the fight. If his combat health bar was full
green, pet him to 100%, a bit off, 80%, more then
a half 60% and so on. Another player, Joeri suggests
that you should always pet him when he wins. From
20% for a fight that was not very good to a maximum
of 70% for a good tip-top fight. The reason for you
not to pet him to 100% is that he might be too dependent
on you. This method could apply to both controlled
and uncontrolled fights. However, it has been reported
that by petting your creature while he is showing
off will only encourage him to show off more; rather
then as a reward for a good fight. This is difficult
to confirm as there is no creature help message within
the game to confirm if the rubbing after the fights
is registered at all by the game and creature.
III. Petting Your Creature
I have been doing an experiment on two different creatures,
one which was trained with the post-fight rubbing,
the other without. The experiment involved with two
different full grown creatures. I have applied the
post-fight rubbing before they begin to show off.
This is to prevent the creature registering the post-fight
rubbing linking it to the action of showing off.
the 69th fight, the creature that was given a post-fight
rubbing as explained above, was dramatically more
aggressive in combat, compared with the creature that
had been trained without such a training method. On
the other hand, the creature that was trained without
the post-fight rubbing had only begun to progress
from the 95th fight. Yet it was not as effective in
combat as the other creature. Therefore I believe
post-fight rubbing contributes to the creature effective
ability to fight.
from the experiment I found that the rubbing only
encourages the aggression in combat rather than a
specific combat style or a certain move. Before my
creature had gotten used to using the flip kick. He
was already an effective fighter and has been petted
to 70% quite often. However, he only adapted the flip
kick in combat after losing a few fights with a top
level creature. For his defeats, I didn’t apply
any post-fight rubbing on the creature, until he was
able to adapt the flip kick and then progress onwards.
is also sensible to accept that the creature will
take encouragement from the rubbing for his aggression
rather than a few specific combination of moves during
the fights. The creature AI registers the last action
they do. In this case the victory of the fight. If
you believe a creature fights in different sets of
patterns, we could argue that the creature is registering
your petting regarding the set of Kung Fu he has been
using rather than the aggression. The game shows no
indication on how the creature registers post-fight
rubbing. So until we have formal confirmation from
the programmers of Lionhead Studios, we can not be
the rubbing does apply on the aggression, then the
theory on creature performance relies on the amount
of your post-fight rubbing should be invalidated.
Since aggression can not be dependent on the player
during combat. Therefore, the scale on post-fight
rubbing depending on the remained health from 100%
heal for 100% petting to 0%Health for 0%petting would
be more sensible.
You can train an effective fighter with or without
using the post-fight rubbing method.
Another method based on uncontrolled fighting is using
the leashes. If the creature AI learns the same method
outside of combat, then the leashes should also have
an effect on combat behavior.
Using Leashes in Combat
Many players believe the leash of aggression (LoA)
would make your creature perform better in creature
combat, because it would make the creature attack
more. By this theory, you could train your creature
to perform differently during combat by having different
leashes on, this also could mean by having the LoL,
the creature would be able to learn combat skills
on leashes: Out side of combat training, I was able
to train a few different creatures differently. One
of them was encouraged for destructive behavior and
the other was more balanced. With the destructive
one, when I used the leash of learning (LoL) to direct
my creature near the enemy’s town, he would
start to destroy the town and anything around it.
On the other hand, the more balanced one would prefer
to impress the village. But when I do use the LoA
to lead the more balanced creature near the enemy’s
town, he would be destructive also. Therefore I understand
that I have encouraged one of my creatures to be destructive
so much that it has became its nature to be aggressive.
friend Unseul has conducted an experiment with the
LoL on a new creature called Lil’git. Lil’git
had only a small amount of controlled fighting experience.
Including the combat training with the guide at the
beginning of the single player game. The rest of the
fights he had was uncontrolled using the LoL. With
only 40 matches, Lil’git was already a highly
skillful player. He was able to produce the appropriate
response to a lot of situations by attacking, blocking,
and dodging accordingly. At that stage he was able
to beat some of the most well known hand trained creatures
in the community such as SilentBob, Dog, and Scar.
success it not only relying on the leash of learning.
It also relies on a training system. The basic training
system for an uncontrolled fight is to place your
creature to fight many different creatures to learn
different styles in combat, but Unseul narrowed the
system more specifically.
would set his creature to fight others in the following
lower level creatures> 3 mid level creatures>
3 computer controlled creatures(CCC)> 3 High level
definition of high or low level depends on your creature’s
idea behind this training system is to produce a balanced
level of fighting skills/moves for your creature and
hopefully he will learn the best from it. Victory
and defeat doesn’t matter here, but it does
represent different skills level which your creature
can be inspired from. If a creature is fighting a
better fighter he would be trained to deal with high
level creature, likewise for fighting a weaker creature.
And by fighting a creature with the similar fighting
skills could balance different actions.
will benefit on both post-fight rubbing training method
and without. But If you believe in the method of post-fight
rubbing it is progressively useful if you apply this
method after different levels of fighting.
a ladder system once he was able to beat a creature
at certain level and have received plenty of rubbing,
you could move on to a higher fighting level by fighting
a greater creature. If you jump the level beyond what
he can deal with comfortably, you would not get a
chance to award him with high percentage. If more
percentage means encouragement for higher aggression
then you could have allowed your creature to benefit
a lot more to fight a suitable level of creature.
matter how you train your creature in combat, in time
it will develop its Kung Fu/pattern of fighting. If
you have been using the uncontrolled training methods,
you should have realized that there will be a point
that you can not provide such a large variety of experience
to your creature and that he learns/changes his pattern
much slower as he is already a highly skilled fighter.
I have began to doubt the ability of the creature’s
AI by having seen a representative fighting pattern
from my creature, which has been in over 500 fights.
My creature would try to produce the same moves in
the same order in certain stages during a fight. I
then did some experiment to see how fixed this fighting
pattern is. I have once did a quick save when my creature
is near its combat training creature, so that I can
just click on the other creature to start a fight
without having to look for it too far. I reloaded
the game and fought for 10 times on the same location
of the combat ring. As the result all ten fights were
100% exactly the same. Both creatures fought in their
own same pattern in these fights. The creatures perform
their moves in the same time and position in all five
of these fights. This means that not only the result
was the same, but the position where they were knocked
back and even the distribution of the waves of attack
was the same. I was basically watching the replay.
are a lot of things that is saved by a save/quick
save. If you have any damage the moment you did a
quick save even if your creature has been fully recovered,
the damage will reappear the moment you reload. A
quick save also stores the creature’s damage
and by watching the reparative results of creature
combats. I believe all fights are fixed and each creature
carries a fighting pattern before entering the combat
ring. The quick save also have stored the particular
fighting patterns that both creatures decided to use.
You could do a simple experiment on how much info
a save store by doing a quick save during the creature
doing a poo. After he has finished, if you load the
game again you will find him wanting to poo again.
surely not all fights featuring the same creatures
are just the same as a reply, there must be a randomization
which has disguised these pattern.
did another experiment by placing my creature in to
60-70 fights with a constant creature. Both of these
creatures are high level fighters. Not only did I
spot that both creatures tend to perform a same order
of attacks, blocks, and dodges at a random stage during
each fight, but from the experience of watching the
creature’s movement carefully, I was able to
tell who will be the winner of the fight from their
There was at least four sets of fighting patterns
and each have an unnoticeable difference. Whenever
the opposite creature moves forward to produce a claw
attack as the first move I would know that he will
win the fight. However, whenever he did the slide
kick first I would win. And the damage that I will
have after the fight would be around 30%. Also if
my creature blocked his first attack which is the
slide kick I would win and be left with around 10%
Sometimes the damage very depending on hunger which
directly effecting on fatness then it effect on damage.
But the different is minimum
you can see, though the combat might seem random and
depending on the actual fight, there is certainly
a pattern that will reappear from time to time. So
I believe each creature carry a few set of fighting
patterns and will use different ones randomly like
a game of paper scissors rock.
this experiment I believe that there is no creature
which can be trained to be able to beat every creature.
If we placed two creatures in a combat ring of similer
skills both will have different sets of fighting styles
and both will have a set of kung fu that can beat
the other creature and a set that would shows a lot
of gaps. It will be depending which set they will
choose to use in order to conclude the result
Teaching Your Creature Combat
The pattern theory does not mean the creature will
just repeat an action blindly, regardless of what
the opposing creature’s action is. In fact it
is all about response towards a target’s action.
But his choice of response is directly related to
the set of pattern he will be using. We know from
my experience of reloading a save that a fight results
in an exact replay. Thus we know this pattern comes
in a set rather than just a few combos. We can call
it the pattern of response. A creature can be using
a set of pattern of responses that will strike a lot
of the time if he sees an incoming attack or a pattern,
that he will attack, block, dodge and pause depending
on target’s action. All these can be taught
and will be depending on the target’s response
to conclude victory. Each of these responses can be
are people who believe that controlled fight are the
makings of a robot fighter and would rather believe
in their creativity in the style of their fighting
by only putting the creature into uncontrolled fights.
This idea is to expect, that in time the creature
will fight differently on each fight. Yet he will
be able to find the most effective way to defeat the
idea also believed that by fighting a better creature:
in enough time he will improve and learn from it.
So my question is will the creature be able to learn
form another creature and spot what is good for him?
did a rough experiment by using a creature which has
never fought before. We call this a blank creature.
I placed it through over 100 uncontrolled fights with
a computer controlled creature. Which is the one you
get from any skirmish default map. Before the creature
first entered his first fight I duplicated a copy
of the creature files (Mind and PHY files) so I have
the same creature at its blank stage. Then I placed
him into over 100 combats with one hand trained creature
mind, lil’git. After the first 100 fights the
results make very less difference. They both have
a certain inconsistent fighting style. They have the
occasion good fight such as attacking in waves and
some victories. However it is inconsistent and there
is no obvious contrast.
after I switched the creature which has been fighting
a CCC into fighting a hand trained creature, he become
much more effective in combat then the other creature
which has been fighting with the hand trained creature.
They both have the same amount of fights of 150 fights
each. The only difference is that one has been fighting
100 times with the CCC and then 50 with lil’git,
a hand trained creature and the other copy of the
same creature has been fighting with lil’git
150 times with no switch.
After the first 100 fights for both creatures, the
result is concluded by placing both creatures fighting
with the hand trained creature lil’git for 20
fights. The further 50 fights began after I restored
the creature minds back to the stage where they have
only had their 100 fights.
been watching different blank creatures combat developments.
I analyzed on how creature AI benefits from this training.
I believe the creature gets used to a style/pattern
from its first fights. Thus early fighting's are important
for a creature. Once you see its pattern in the first
few fights you will see it evolve around it throughout
his fighting career, unless you have been applying
controlled fight training. If you were to place him
with a high level creature to start with it would
get used to the style with coping with the target
rather then copying the target’s action. Therefore
if you place him in a fight more with a high level
fighter he might not attack as much if you were to
let him fight with a lower level creature where it
will get more chances in attacking.
creature has an instinct to attack, dodge, and block
in a fight. It will “learn” by getting
used to how to achieve the goal under the experience
of different situations. If he gets used to that he
can do a slide kick from a long range, then he more
likely to perform a side kick whenever he is in range.
On the other hand, if he has been attacked by a side
kick whenever he is in range with the target, he would
prepared for a block instead.
Going back to Unseul’s method of switching fighting
targets for his training for lil’git. He provided
the targets for the creature to train with progressively.
From fighting CCC then moving on to higher level of
hand trained creatures granted him success in creature
we do support this theory on the creature's’s
learning ability in combat, which is what they got
used to. Then this will automatically support the
method on using leash of aggression for the creature
during combat. From personal experience using the
LoA does make the creature behave more aggressive,
therefore by placing him into many fights for being
aggressive he should develop an aggressive foundation.
is the creature AI able to decide which is the best
move to perform under different situations? The answer
is at the beginning of its fighting career it is aware
of the available moves at a certain position. Such
as knowing that the slide kick can start from a long
distant, just like a fireball can shoot from a long
range outside combat. However he would get used to
his habits under different situations and it would
become a more and more fixed pattern as he become
may ask, why did the creature which has been fighting
100 times with the CCC, become a much better fighter
after 50 fights with a high level hand trained creature?
Should it not be a much greater fighter when it got
used to beating up somebody pretty badly?
Advanced Creature Combat
After my creature was established with his fighting
regime. I continued to try to improve his fighting
style and how he should respond to a target’s
action. It was however at the stage of fighting around
a fix pattern. He has already fought nearly 600 matches
with many different creatures. From my friend’s
creature minds to fighting with other online players.
I believe when your creature reaches to the stage
of an established fighter, he would not learn too
much from uncontrolled fights. Its just like training
your creature outside of combat. The creature will
have its instinct and natural response with the environment.
However when you have trained your creature into a
more established fashion, he would often repeat what
he has encroached for and what has been showed. When
you want him to perform a certain action that is outside
of his usual routine it does require your direction.
I began his first controlled fight training.
a realistic point of view, if a creature does not
change into a more effective fighting pattern after
600 fights. I would rather to give up my romantic
idea of freestyle and creativity in creature combat
for awhile and direct him to fight in to a more desirable
style such as placing him into 20 controlled fights.
further studies on how a creature takes note from
your direction during a controlled fight. . . to put
it simply, it will respond to one single action to
each situation. These responses are also depending
a lot on its distant between the target and moves.
If you told your creature to slide kick whenever the
target is in range many times, then he will do so
more often. And if you tell him to flip kick the target
when it is close, then he will take note. By doing
the these two actions you will realize your creature
will do these two actions as a combo whenever he is
in range. That does not mean he is aware of what a
combo is or has a plan that he will slide kick and
then do a flip kick. The creature thinks in one single
action at a time. It just happened that he ended up
really close to the target after the slide kick and
his reaction to the position being close to the target
is to produce a flip kick.
the other hand, if you told your creature to block
a slide kick whenever he see one and if he is not
producing any action at the time he will learn to
block it when the slide kick is produced at certain
course if he blocked it and the target ended up close
enough, he will produce the response you have encouraged
him for. Which is a flip kick at close distant.
understanding which moves will be produced at which
position. You can shape up your creature in your desired
style through controlled fights.
I move on to my analysis on the creature combats moves,
here is the summary:
can learn differently using different leashes.
rubbing should contribute to the aggression during
could establish its fighting style by what he has
gotten used to.
might carry a few fighting patterns/behaviors and
should apply them differently before each fight. These
patterns behavior could based on the respond on the
target’s action. Such as the behavior that tends
to block rather than strike while under attack, etc.
take note from your direction during combat rather
if you use leashes or not
should have no idea on what “combo” moves
are. It should perform based on range, position and
expects for the programmers from Lionhead to know
all the answers on how the creature would improve
or learn in combat. We can only rely on our experience.
controlled combat: K.U.N.G.F.U. 2
The idea of controlled fight is to train your creature
to get used to producing a certain response under
following notes are based upon my research on the
part one of this article, which I believe creatures
learn their combat response based on what he has been
getting used to. Also creatures can carry a few sets
of fighting patterns, for more details, see part one.
ideal concept of controlled fighting is that in time,
your creature would copy all of your directions.
my research, there are a few ways I have been looking
at the fighting pattern. I began my experiments by
focusing the creature fighting pattern on their combat
are two main factors would be helpful to understand,
which are damage and interruption.
is caused when the attacking part of the creature
body touches the target, which means if a move that
is slow and covers a large area, it would do better
damage than a fast move that covers only a small area.
strike also has a knock back factor, when an attack
is land, it will first produce damage, then a knock
back and finally recovery the attacking part of the
body back to the ready position to strike again or
it is a disadvantage if your creature block a move
which is already half landed (at the stage before
the knock back is produced) because he would allow
the arm or leg to drag across its own body without
being knocked back.
other important factor is interruption. If interruption
move usually have a fast producing time but low damage,
the slide kick is an example of an interrupting move,
it is fast and its useful to gain distinct, but the
damage is low.
two factors would help to find the right balance of
response. The whole game is similar to paper, scissors,
and rock, there is no one move that is better than
are some description of moves based on my personal
kick, a kick that can be produced in mid distance,
mid speed, mid recovery time and a large knock back,
but it can not be produce too close.
kick, the fastest
kick that you can produce, it is a useful move, because
it gains a close distance to the target, fast recovery
time, and short knock back but rubbish damage.
kick- a move
that can be produced under a short time, close to
mid distance, slow recovery time, low to mid damage.
claws can be produce under very short time, with minimum
recovery time and cover a large area of the target’s
body, which mean they can be reproduced very quickly
and can create great damage.
begin from above the target and run across downward
and produce a short knock back, a useful stopper for
across the target from right to left and produce a
largest knock back under the claw category.
that knocks the target’s balance, knocks the
target a side under minimum distance. This move can
kill a smaller creatures models from full health if
strikes successfully and repeated.
is also the sheep’s model’s killer move
when they do the lower spin.
Smaller model such as a horse.
moves are efficient under different situation, but
for a more advanced creature, it is just like a game
of paper scissors, rock.
I have been directing my creature on producing the
most effective move under different situations, I
have developed an early theory on how it adopts your
direction form controlled fighting.
of the perspectives is that, a creature carries patterns
and would produce offensive moves by a certain order.
If your creature has a pattern of attacking with two
claws in a roll, then if the creature is in the right
distance to produce a slide kick, he would walk forward
towards to the target and claw.
the pattern would be reset if your creature is knocked
out of the ring, then the next move would based on
his response that he got used to under the situation.
If the creature got used to producing a claw at the
edge of the ring while the target is waiting for him
to return, then he would walk towards to the target
and try to produce the claw, there is a high chance
that the creature would be knocked out again due to
his forward step, and if he still wanting to reproduce
his attempt of the move, then it is likely to repeat
the process and turn into a waves of knock out’s
further observation, I began to look at the over all
fighting pattern on how the creature develops.
perspective to see your creatures pattern is rhythm.
I have trained a creature as a tiger to produce frontal
kick by clicking/aiming on the middle to lower part
of the target for over 20 fights, as the result the
creature developed to be quite a good fighter at mid
range while uncontrolled. When I change the creature
type into a Brown Bear, he would continue to produce
mid range attack such as a fast frontal jab. As any
experienced Brown-Bear-controlled-fight-player would
know, to produce a fast front Jab, the area which
you should aim for is the high upper body of the target.
proves that the creature does not take direction of
where you click, otherwise take note of the rhythm.
By rhythm, I mean the time to attack, block and dodge.
For example, if you have been directing him to produce
attacking moves that has a very less recovery time,
he would do so regardless what moves it takes to match
his attacking rhythm.
this theory, we could train a creature to be a reckless
attacker by understanding the attacking moves and
use the ones that has the least recovery time, landing
the attack one right after the other.
reality, this reckless attackers are limited by the
reaction of the target and its own movements.
reckless attacker could react very quickly to produce
his next in range and in time move, however, the target
‘s back step often move quicker than a close
range attack, since he is out of his close range but
automatically fit in to the mid range, the attacking
creature would produce a mid range attack. If the
target decided to step forward once again, the time
he react to his movement would result him to step
back and find his target in range, resulting two creatures
moving forward and backward and try to find range
for their in range and in time attack.
I was to see the fighting pattern as a rhythm as the
explained theory above, we could understand why the
game would produce an exact replay every time we reload
it if we save the game right before a creature combat
(for more detail see part one). Because I believe
it is easier for the game to record a rhythm which
is time, than to record the exact movement of what
the creatures would produce in order.
is also evidence by the aggression and defensive tags
in the creature cave. A controlled fight creature
often easily to increase their aggressive tags, since
your direction within the combat ring establish beyond
time. By that I mean, the creature would produce the
move without the process of “thinking”
and finding range but to produce whatever move that
is in range.
Part one of K.U.N.G.F.U. I suggested that creature
learns by what they gotten used to combine with their
natural instincts of attack, block and dodge, if the
rhythm theory applies, combining with the theories
established in part 1, then controlled fighting contribute
a great deal in developing your creature combat, and
can skip many uncontrolled fights using the progressive
level combat training as suggested in part one. (See
training history of a creature named, lil’git)
understanding the range, recovery time and knocks
back on each moves, you could develop and change your
creature’s rhythm creatively.
trick all these limitations of getting into the rhythm,
I once developed a fighter using a so called, ”Fake
term, Fake Hand is a term is used by real Kung Fu
combatants. It is a movement that trickier off the
opponent’s reaction, for both defensive and
offensive purpose. You could say a fake hand is to
test of your opponent or an attempt to scare him.
A good example is the combat between Bruce Lee anted
Chuck Norris in the movie, Fist Of Fury. While Lee
was under attack and did a fake hand by only showing
his palm and place Norris into defensive mode.
Black and White, this trick also works in some situation,
a fake hand would mean to make your creature blocking
under unusual situation. For offensive target, many
creature would attempt to approach at close distinct,
which could leave some weakness for your creature,
of course, your creature must know how to deal with
the situation of post-fake hand, otherwise it would
be an disadvantage.
could learn his uncontrolled fighting skill from controlled
could adopt the rhythm you have been directing him
rather than the exact location where you been clicking
your creature is undoubtedly intelligent, its mind
works differently from ours, Knowing
what to do in these situations can realy help you
first land in eden is for you to train your creature
the basics, and many people rush ahead to
land 2. Pay attention to your creature's mood, Its
not wise to have him wandering around your village
when angry. He might start casting fireballs or eating
your villagers, if on the other hand your
little bundle of joy is feeling playfull by all means
bring him to your village, its the perfect place
for him to share his feelings, It is advised to keep
the creature help at its highest for beginners,
as it will inform you on its behaviour.
creature notices nearly everything going on around
him, even off the leash. It tries to copy
most stuff you do, From throwing people around to
watering crops. Be carefull what you teach your
creature, bad habits are hard to break. If your creature
starts performing odd things, its basically
because you inadvertently taught it to,
people get this problem with there creature, He wont
eat the food when given to him, He just throws
it over its shoulder, and the instant we see this,
we slap him. You should never punis your creature
this, Creatures throw stuff over their shoulders when
they are unsure what to do wih the object, its just
a reflex action, Its sometimes hard to get a creature
to understand the objects property, Again i stress,
Teach them what to do when there young.